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We're back! New week, new chaos. This week, Shawn tells us about his near rollover in his sprinter van, we review Figmas new multi edit updates, the Rivian R3X release (spoiler, we love it), and billionaire tech utopias being built outside San Francisco. This is also our last podcast with our amazing product designer Caitlin before she moves to a SF tech utopia and becomes a cyborg. Drop her some love in the comments.

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Transcript

Elysse: [00:00:00] Okay, that's good. I feel less like a jerk now. Gavin: No, it's all good. Ah, Elysse: well. Here we are. Gavin: We made it. Are we recording already? Oh shit. Yeah. I'm late. Oh, my bad. I have exciting news. Uh, my play date arrived. Yeah. The, uh, the one I ordered like three episodes ago or something like that. Unfortunately it's dead right now. Like the battery. So it's plugged in charging. Otherwise I'd be sitting here playing with it. But I unboxed it's gorgeous, man. Everything teenage and engineering touches is just amazing. Cause like. Panic, the software company, made it, but in collaboration with TE as, like, the hardware manufacturer and designers. And it's just, like, small, and well designed, and, like, hefty, like, it doesn't feel like a cheap Game Boy, it's, like, a heavy piece of metal. And, like, the crank just has, like, this texture to it when you turn it, ah, it's, it's crazy. So, anyway. My work [00:01:00] productivity this week is going to go to shit. Cause the reason I bought it is I wanted to make a game for it. So I've downloaded the SDK and I'm just like, okay, what am I thinking? What are we going to make? I have no idea. Right. The first thing I got to figure out is how to just like move a pixel around a sprite around when I press buttons. That's that's stage one. Caitlin: That's fun. Can we see it physically? Gavin: I could go grab it. It's plugged in, but, um, yeah, I'll, I'll be right back. One sec. Caitlin: Oh, his camera's just zooming in. Shawn: Weird. That's creepy. Caitlin: That was really creepy. Elysse: Do you have Nash nearby? He's in the background. He's right there. He blends into the bedsheets. He's just, Oh, that is it right there. Oh, that's the dog. Shawn: A doggy carpet. Gavin, your camera was doing some weird stuff in your absence. Gavin: Oh, I think it's cause it's my, um, my iPhone where it does like the auto tracking or whatever. So anyway, Elysse: Oh, Oh, that's it. Gavin: So this is actually, this is a case on it. [00:02:00] I'll take the case off. But like That's the thing. Like if you see my hand size, I got small hands. So like this thing's tiny. Oh, it's Elysse: so like narrow. It's like a credit card size. Yeah. Shawn: That's way nicer than I imagined. It's super cool. It's doing a system update right now. But yeah, look at that. I thought it Elysse: was going to be like brickish, like big. And then Gavin: this is all magnetic. So then if I, yeah, if I put this on, right. There's like little metal clasps on the back that it like snaps into. And then this has little nubs that are magnetic. Shawn: Well, there's some really Caitlin: nice colors. I would say Gavin, I Shawn: think every week you should buy something and then show it on the following podcast will become like the shopping channel for nerds. I love it. Caitlin: Called QVC that American software engineers. Gavin: Anyway, it's, it's, it's gorgeous. I haven't played it yet. It's torturing me and it's battery charging and [00:03:00] software update, but, um, I'm really excited to, to dig into it. Elysse: Can we also get an update on how you're liking your mechanical keyboard? Gavin: Yeah, uh, so I got, man, this, this podcast is expensive for me, like, I got this, the, uh, I think it's a Keychron, I don't, to fair, um, uh, disclosure, I'm, like, not a super fluent person in, uh, mechanical keyboards, I asked most of the team about it, um, anyway, I set it all on this Keychron, the K2 version 2, and it's been great, it's, like, got nice, uh, Sort of clackety loud keys, but they're not super obnoxious. I have like what's called the brown keys, which is Tactile but not, um, I don't know what the next stage is. I forget what it is, but I don't know if you can hear that Elysse: Yeah, Gavin: but it's uh, yeah, it's great. My wife hates it, which means it's awesome. And My daughter thinks it's ridiculous She came into my room. She's like, what are you doing? What is this thing? Yeah Shawn: Caitlin, I think you're [00:04:00] muted. Hello. There you go. Check one, Caitlin: two. Um, yeah, I was just curious for, uh, people who just use normal keyboards. What's the benefit of having a clickity clack? Uh, Shawn: the benefits. That's really it. It's just fun. Caitlin: Interesting. So it's like a. Gavin: Yeah, it's surprising on, um, cause I'm used to my little thin Apple keyboard, but it's just typing on it. Um, I didn't realize wasn't satisfying until I used. The mechanical keyboard. And there's something about chunky keys that click that when I'm working, I feel like I'm getting more work done. I don't know what it is. It's like, it's totally a mental state, but it's just, uh, it's really fun. It is. I get it. I, I understand. Sensory Shawn: experience. You feel the results of your work. You're like, you hear it too, right? Gavin: Yeah. You feel, you hear it, you see it. It's got like LEDs on the background. Go like, Oh, rainbow color and shit. It's great. I think. Especially as a, um, someone that works on a computer, [00:05:00] like in the software industry or whatever, those little things go a long way, you know, like comfortable headphones, comfortable seat, a keyboard that makes you feel like you're physically somewhere. Because it's easy to just like the screen almost like zooms in and you forget where you are a lot of the time. Right. So I think it's those little things that people would look outward in and think are ridiculous, but someone that does this for like eight to 10 hours a day, It's the little things that, uh, kind of bring you back to reality. Caitlin: Make it more pleasurable. Elysse: Yeah. Yeah. Um, Chunky Keys is a good band name. Chunky Shawn: Keys. Yeah. Oh yeah. It sounds like some kind of like jazz funk world music, maybe. Elysse: Yeah. Um, Sean, before we get into Lynx, I know you also had an experience this week. Well. Shawn: Yeah. Why is it me who has all the near death experiences and brings them to the podcast? I'm really questioning my, um. That's Gavin: your thing now.[00:06:00] Elysse: Yeah, I would buy stuff. Why can't I be the guy Shawn: who buys things? So Shawn: I was, I was on my way to work yesterday. I was driving my van. I have a 2021 Mercedes Sprinter. It's big. It's like the 170 wheelbase. Um, so I'm barreling down the highway. I'm in the fast lane. I'm always speeding a little bit on the oncoming side of the divided highway. There's like a gold Chevy, like Cirrus or something, just like a. A piece of shit 2000 Chevy, um, in the, in the fast lane on the oncoming side of the divided highway, suddenly swerves like a big drift fishtail. I'm like, what is that person doing? At first I don't think anything of it. Yeah. And then they head toward the little emergency access that connects the two sides of the divided highway. And uh, sure enough, they start taking it. And even as I see them swerve into there. I don't think they're gonna come [00:07:00] into the oncoming like it's my brain isn't computing just yet but then just like that they just keep going like right toward me and I'm like, I'm gonna kill this person. Like my vehicle is huge, you know So I do the biggest swerve like something I wouldn't normally attempt in a van like I swerve all the way over to the shoulder basically Wow And she still hits me like on my rear quarter panel like we connect You At highway speed, you know, and um, it spins my van. So I'm like sideways on the highway taking up multiple lanes and I start to roll. I swear my wheels came off the ground. Like I swear I was on two wheels. And Gavin: man, to see a sprinter doing that on the highway. I would, there was Shawn: two people behind me on the road. The guy behind me sent me a text this morning. Like you must have angels watching out for you, buddy. Cuz. I saw that it was insane, you know, and uh, yeah, so anyway, so I, I'm like basically up on two wheels. [00:08:00] I'm trying to steer into the ditch. I credit my years of driving like a total idiot, drifting every car I own to save my life. That and the Mercedes anti roll traction control. But um, anyway, I, I end up hitting the ditch. My wheels come back down. I leave just like a mud streak through the ditch. I go into the oncoming side. Fortunately, I miss the cars that just pass and there's like a gap in the traffic oncoming. I go over both oncoming lanes into the oncoming shoulder, swerve again, and head back across to the ditch where I finally park on the shoulder of the oncoming side. Just like totally rattled thinking like how did I not roll over just now? Um, and uh Yeah, it was wild. Like I, there was one moment where I was just about to hit the ditch. I thought I was going to roll and I'm like doing this mental check. I'm like, okay, seatbelt check, shoulders [00:09:00] back, head against my headrest, brace for impact. This could be it. I may never see my daughter again. Like it literally was like, um, it was so insane. I was on such a high yesterday, just like this adrenaline, like, um, But anyway, the van took it like a champ. She hit my rear driver's side quarter panel. Like the front of her car looked really bad and my van just has a couple of dents. She hit my ladder from my roof rack first. Caitlin: Thank God though, right? Shawn: I think the ladder absorbed the impact. Oh yeah, oh yeah. It was almost like having like a crash bar on the vehicle or something. So anyway, I'm gonna, I'm gonna take it into assurance. Um, the, uh, the driver's dad called me last night. Um, like she was young, she was on her way to university. She's probably in her early twenties. And, um, the driver's dad called me and he's like, Hey, uh, sort of call. I was talking to my daughter. I can't get a straight story out of her. She says she went into oncoming traffic and hit [00:10:00] a van, but she just went to school after, like, can you get the story straight for me? I was like, man, that's exactly what happened. Like I, I dodged so I wouldn't kill her, you know? And, uh, she hit me. And, uh, you know, like, we, we both walked away from it, like, not a scratch on either of us. Caitlin: She is never gonna, well, you said she drove after, right? Shawn: Yeah, she just drove to school, back to school, went to school. Caitlin: I would not ever get in a wheel. No, no, no. That is insane. How long would you say this whole thing happened? Over, like, a minute? Shawn: Oh yeah, I mean, the, the, the, like, yeah, probably under a minute, all the drama, you know? Oh, that's insane. Um, yeah, it was like, it was so wild, like. Elysse: Do you ever think, like, if you left even ten seconds later that day? Shawn: Yeah. You know what? Yeah. So, um, I did think that, but what I [00:11:00] actually thought was, Oh, if I had only sped up instead of slow down, she wouldn't have hit me, you know, but like, you know, what happens you're driving? Like, yeah, I was like, I should have just stomped on it and been like, dodge this car, you know? But Elysse: what was it like to hear at like everything fall out of all of the cupboards in the back? Like I imagine that the sensory overload of that sound you was probably smashing Shawn: and like out of all days So I I left my thermos at the office yesterday the day before yesterday So I was actually like heading to work with a glass Like a ceramic mug full of coffee on my passenger seat. And now the entire cab of my van is just coated in coffee. And, uh, also I had the office coffee maker, the Mocha Master, um, in the back because I took it home for like a family thing. I wanted to have a bigger coffee pot at home. So it was just in my van. And the thing [00:12:00] just rattled around every wall and smashed. So, Elysse: R. I. P. Mocha Master. R. I. P. Mocha Master. Oh no. Um, Shawn: and then like, the gas struts on my like, upper cabinets opened up. They're not supposed to, you know. Yeah. I must have rattled it pretty hard, and everything started flying out. Like my, um, my pour over, I had a ceramic pour over thing. I still haven't found the pieces. I found a few shattered pieces of it. Um, like, there's just broken stuff. Oh, and there was a bunch of water all over one of the seats. And I'm like, my plumbing system is off for the winter. I didn't find a plumbing leak. You know what it was? It was a little can of chicken stock got punctured somehow and chicken stock just got sprayed everywhere. That's crazy. That's a hell of an impact. Yeah. It moved one of my benches a little bit. So I do have to check out some of the like structural bits of my camper. To make sure that it's okay. I was going to Caitlin: say BC highways are gnarly. I think [00:13:00] after a year of driving on the highways here, after moving from the East coast, I bought a dash cam because the amount of accidents I had to be like first responder on, or I was about to be in one was just like insane. Like, yeah. It's, yeah, BC is crazy on the highways. Elysse: It's like, you drive the Coquihalla anytime you do it, there's at least like one incinerated car and you're like, how is this happening? Every time, Gavin: every time, every time in Caitlin: Squamish to Vancouver, like that was, I was like, I don't know if it's going to take me an hour or seven hours because of an accident is going to close the highway. I hate this highway. Elysse: Yeah. We've been stuck on the Cedar sky for, Seb was stuck on it for like 10 hours once overnight. He ended up turning around at four in the morning to go sleep at his office. And that was really crazy. Yeah, it sucks. Shawn: We had a work event in Vancouver that Nick drove down from Squamish for. Nick is our head of design. And um, we gave everyone swag and in the swag bag were some custom IPAs that we had a local brewery make. [00:14:00] And uh, he got stuck for hours, but he was only like, A two hour walk from home or something like that. And it was like 11 PM. So he said, I just hopped parked on the shoulder, hopped out, grabbed my swag bag, drank the beers on the way home. And they were like these like 7 percent IPAs. I got home just like cut. And my partner was like, what are you doing? Caitlin: He just left his car there. That's very funny. Hmm. Gavin: That's hilarious. Caitlin: I love it. Well, glad to hear Sean is okay. But yeah, hopefully that never happens again. Shawn: Yeah. My poor van. Oh. Anyway. Caitlin: Who cares about the van? My god. Shawn: The van is like a family member. Caitlin: Yeah, you're like the mocha machine. You Shawn: got the coffee maker. My ceramic cup. The Elysse: coffee, the, or what is the pour over cup that was probably incinerated [00:15:00] in the, because you can't find the pieces. Shawn: I mean, in my defense, I got the pour over in San Francisco at a farmer's market on a road trip. Elysse: Oh yeah, it's got some. Sentimental. Yeah, that's fair. What else should we jump into? Let's click some links. Okay, let's do it. Um. Caitlin actually introduced me to this first one. I thought it was pretty cool. Chef's kiss. Movavi. com. Shawn: Cool. What is this, Caitlin? Caitlin: It's like a 4k screen recording software. It's really affordable. Um, you actually get like proper high quality screen recordings and you can trim and edit the videos right in the software and then export them at whatever size you need. It's fantastic. Wow, so cool. Yeah. QuickTime doesn't quite get the quality you need sometimes. And this is actually great for like capturing softwares and how they work. If you really just want to get a quick demo or something like that, and you want it to be like a crisp, uh, 4k resolution and it does it so pretty good. [00:16:00] Does so much stuff. Yep. Gavin: Nice. Most of the vid, most of the videos there are like, um, like footage though. It doesn't look like screenshot. So like, they must have two different angles here, I guess. But like your use case was to use it for screen recording. Elysse: Yeah, that's true. Yeah, that's very true. They must have a, just like an editor. Yeah, they have products, Caitlin: like different products. They have the editor, they have the screen recorder and then like something else. But I just use the screen recorder. It is the bomb. Highly recommend. Elysse: And they have photo editing. Interesting. Uh, Sean, you asked how to pronounce it. I think it's Movavi, right? Shawn: Yeah, that was my assumption. Or is Gavin: it mov? A VI Mo? No. Oh, like Shawn: a VI AbbVie? It could be. Oh, it's almost like the two, like do move AbbVie. Yeah. Yeah. Interesting. Caitlin: Avi. Shawn: Hmm. Caitlin: Yeah, I don't know. , it Shawn: sounds like a product that like they didn't actually name. It was like [00:17:00] a Python script, the news AbbVie editor, , and like eventually it just became that. Like Gavin: one of those, uh, auto generating things be like, you know, I need AVI files that can be edited by my movie editor. And it's like, how about Movavi? You're like, Oh, perfect. Shawn: Naming is fun. They got the domain. So yeah, that's half the battle. And it's 80 percent off with this marquee gradient. Cool. They Caitlin: always have sales. It's fantastic. Wow. This is 900. Dollars. I think that's for like all of it though with AI and, yeah, the whole platform. I only use one of the products for screen recording. Elysse: Wow. That's like 900 is not, not expensive. Shawn: Yeah. And it's not a lamp. I like that you can buy it though. Like it's kind of nice that, um, It's not subscription. Yeah, it's not, you can just buy it and use it. That sounds really refreshing. So is it on for [00:18:00] 182 off of 900? Like that's really some price anchoring they're playing with. Yeah. Caitlin: Interesting. It's not special. It's like cheap, like literally dirt cheap. This is like, yeah, 700 off. Yeah. Just cause. I think I paid 30 bucks for my, uh, purchase. It was on sale for the screen recorder. So pretty good deal. Elysse: I mean, I, I want to know what the price is for that now. I'm curious. Shawn: Whoa, Elyse, have you opened all the links in tabs in your browser ahead of time? Wow. That's really organized. Elysse: I do that every week. Caitlin: Oh, there you go. 43 for the year on the left. And I had it on sale for like 30 bucks. That's fine. Shawn: Nice. Yeah. I use it Caitlin: all the time. Shawn: Well, that seems like a new link. Let's do it. Elysse: Um, Lula shared this, some Figma [00:19:00] news. This is a little Instagram reel, but, um, some of their multi edit. I love it. Updates. Oh, that's sweet. Cool. Shawn: I mean, I'm going to be honest. I didn't know it didn't do that ahead of time. I'm not a Figma user. I don't get it. Caitlin: Well, this is if you don't have components set up in Figma and let's say you have like a, a tab that's named a certain, let's say just called it like tab one. You can click the tab one and it'll find all of the similar components. And then you could just update the text across all of them, which is great. Yeah. Cause not everything's a component, right? So, Shawn: yeah. That's great. Oh, that's, yeah. I love it. Caitlin: Yeah, for efficiency, that's great. Yeah. And it's awesome because I always feel like I have to put things into components. Like eSpot was a good example. We had so many screens changing constantly. So I put everything into components, which it didn't need to be. Just so you can update those titles really quick. But this is great. This kind of solves that. I'm like Shawn: a Figma noob. I made the transition from Photoshop to Sketch [00:20:00] and then like started dabbling in Figma. Just as I stopped doing design as a, like, as part of my job. And, uh, I'm like a detach instance kind of guy. Like if I have to edit something at Figma, I'm just like, turn off all the special things. Figma is, I Caitlin: think, um, I noticed that Webflow and Figma are really trying to integrate with each other, each other quite a bit. Um, but I think for someone who knows. Coding and backends, development, CSS, all of that. They're really trying to like adhere to some of the terminology that you guys use, like fixed positioning or, you know, inline block, all that. And Figma is doing that too right now. So Shawn: cool. Do you think we'll ever see a combined web flow and Figma like fig flow? Um, big flow. There's fig jam, right? Caitlin: You can actually, uh, import a file from Figma straight to web flow and it'll generate the whole. [00:21:00] Page for you Gavin: crazy. Caitlin: Like, well, it's okay. Like for mobile responsive, that's not really the easiest, but it's a good place to start. I always go from scratch personally. Cause like I I'm much quicker in web flow than having to rename everything. Um, but reloom that link we saw previously, the AI generating like, um, wireframing and sitemap, you can export that directly to web flow or Figma. So, cool. Yeah. Shawn: Amazing. I really want to get more up to speed on like no code stuff. I know that's not exactly what we're talking about, but, um, I feel like there's just like lots of things you can do in no code that might save us some time that we might eventually want to code from scratch, but like, anyway, that's, that's a little tangent. Elysse: She was crazy. I did a UI UX thing at BCIT, like maybe two years ago, I finished it. They taught us XD and not Figma. Isn't that crazy? Gavin: Is that Adobe? [00:22:00] Yeah. Yeah. Elysse: Like two years ago, two years ago, they were like, use XT. And I was like, I don't think so. Shawn: Pretty sure this is, yeah, I've met other students. It's a total educational institution scam. It's really just Adobe's enterprise sales people making inroads into educational institutions, but it's totally doing students a disservice. It's like teaching kids Java Gavin: these days. I'm like, I'm sorry, that's not the language you should be learning. And educational Shawn: institutions are doing that as well. Yeah, they're still doing it. Caitlin: Also, teachers that are teaching in those programs repeatedly every year don't keep up to date with new softwares. So they won't even be eligible to teach Figma if they didn't use it. So yeah, yeah, yeah. Elysse: Well, cool. Next one. Real time colors, realtimecolors. com. Visualize your colors and fonts. Shawn: Oh, interesting. So you like plug in a color scheme and then it does it lay it out on a [00:23:00] website? Just like a website. Do you pick a theme? Oh, that's cool. Caitlin: Yeah. So you can update the colors to see how it would look if the text, um, background browser. Yeah, exactly. Gavin: At least you need UX school. Caitlin: I'm just, I'm just adding chaos. I love it. I think if you scroll down, there's also a Figma plugin for this as well. Hold on. I have Elysse: to reset these colors. Oh no, Gavin: it remembers quick. Roll the dice, roll the dice. Caitlin: I can't see anything. Okay. Here we go. There you go. Yeah. Plugin users. There you go. Shawn: That's fun. Caitlin: Cool. Cause sometimes you pick color palettes as a designer and then you actually implement them and you're like, this does not work. Shawn: At all. This reminds me a little bit of Arc allowing you to add your own style sheet to any website. Um, so yeah, like the Arc internet browser, you can say you hate your banking [00:24:00] website. You can just like redesign it and every time you visit it. It will do that. I've never heard of this. Can people share Gavin: their own, uh, like, it would be awesome if there was a marketplace for like better skins. So like the banking site example, one is great where it's like, Hey, use this, install this skin for this site. And you're like, Oh my God, this is beautiful. Caitlin: That is so interesting. Yeah. Caitlin arc. Oh, so Lula was talking about right on our morning. Yeah. Yeah. Is this what Elysse: you're talking about? Sean? Shawn: Yeah, Cory says he's like bought into it. I'm like, I'm honestly I haven't Like it's really not any better than chrome for me because I haven't used any of the fun features yet um, but it apparently has a bunch of fun features that We need cory or somebody to come on and like talk about why they like arc Because I haven't I haven't bought in yet. Elysse: I'm kind of the same. I have it but I haven't bought in Caitlin: I don't see a need for it right now. Like i'm fine with my current setup And [00:25:00] until that changes. Ooh. Yeah. Wow. Gavin: Yeah. I mean, I, I just use Safari. I'm boring. Caitlin: Why do you still use Safari? Just curious. Gavin: Um, I don't know. It's the browser that's on my Mac. I mean, I have Chrome for when I need it, but honestly, I just use Safari and because it's on my like phone and my iPad and all the other stuff, it's like, I can do the handoff or whatever. So I'd like, I'll have something open. I'll sit on the couch and be like, Oh yeah, I'm going to finish reading that article. There's just so much, like if you really drink the apple Kool Aid sure. There's some tooling out there that's better for certain things, but I find mine's more, uh, a continuity can continue. Yes. Thank you. Um, Problem where like I'm moving between either offices or placement or devices and if I just use all the apple stuff It all just kind of figures its stuff out So yeah, Caitlin: oh my gosh chrome needs to stop adding profiles every time I log into an [00:26:00] account. That's Different. Gavin: Yeah You go into google or whatever and sign in it's like do you want to attach this as a profile? I'm like, please stop Caitlin: and you click the button just to dismiss it really quick and you click the okay each time And then you have like 40 profiles. Oh my god Shawn: Well, and and now they've just introduced this password manager and I made the mistake of clicking yes on some websites Oh, but the stupid thing is is they make you enter Your like google password So it's time, right? Google password or is it my system password anyway? So it's like, do you want to use your Google password for this? I'm like, yes. And then it asks you for a password. I'm like, if I wanted to enter a password, I would have just entered that password and now I'm clicking yes. And entering a password. Thanks Google. Caitlin: Oh my God. What's the likelihood of Google getting hacked and all your passwords getting leaked? I Shawn: wonder about this. And now I'm feeling, um, password management anxiety. I have a lot of things in one password. That's sort of like, I use a different password for everything. So [00:27:00] it's not like somebody is going to get my password and go on a rampage through all my accounts, you know, but, um, So I got stuff in one password and that's like my source of truth. But then Apple saves some passwords and Chrome saves some passwords. And now Apple's doing this thing where they like, don't let you enter your own password into like where it. It's like an extra step to go choose my own password when you go to sign up for something. Like, it's so annoying. It's like, um, I didn't opt into this Apple password management thing. I find that annoying because it's all in one password. So now I'm like telling Apple I need to choose my own password and going to one password and generating a password and bringing it back over. Like passwords are just a real nightmare right now. Caitlin: There needs to be a better way. And I'm so like, right now Google is like the house of my life. Like everything is there and it has a really good security, like feature where you can like get texts to your phone or your other email. But if [00:28:00] someone were to get into like Gmail. Gavin: It's just like, it's everything. Caitlin: I, I would disappear from the face of the planet. Like someone would literally have access to everything. Elysse: That's how all those like netflix documentaries start with like this person got my like google Into my like gmail account and that was it. That was Caitlin: the end that was the end like you could literally do whatever you want after that like Yeah, Shawn: so I don't know. Um, like this isn't a canadian podcast, I guess. I mean, we're all canadians So maybe it is a canadian podcast. But anyways in canada, we have this interact e transfer thing You can send people money bank to bank. I always thought it was really secure because like the banks all support it Anyway, I sent a contractor I'm not angry enough at this point to name him on the podcast, but one day maybe Anyways, so I sent I sent a contractor about 5, 000 in two separate payments for some work on my house and [00:29:00] He Followed up a few months later Said hey this invoices still do I'm like dude. I sent you to eat transfers to the email address you specified You And they were accepted, you know, um, so I follow up with my bank and they do a trace on them and like somebody else's name, like they went into a bank account belonging to somebody with a different name than that guy. Um, so I'm like, well, the only explanation here is that like somebody got into your email and accepted those transfers, you know? Um, and I've got like the, the source trace. Um, of the, of the, um, the transfers and everything, so I know that's what happened. And, uh, anyway, this dude's a jackass, and he's like, uh, So I said, I said, look, man, um, It's sad that your email got hacked, and you didn't get paid for this work that you did. It's also sad that I'm out 5, 000 bucks. Yeah. But [00:30:00] I'll split the difference with you. Look, I will pay you 50 percent again, um, and so you don't have to take the loss on this project, you know? And he says, I'm going to talk to my lawyer and, uh, I haven't heard from him since. So anyways. Cause his Gavin: lawyer's like, you're an idiot and you're out five grand. Shawn: I even went so far as to call this guy's it company. He said, no, I had my it company do like a forensic analysis on my email. And, uh, I wasn't hacked. I was like, first of all, that's just bullshit. What does that mean? Um, so anyways, I called the IT company, and I'm like, hey, you gotta let your customer know they were hacked. Like, there's no other explanation. Somebody got into his email and accepted the e transfer. Um, and, uh, Anyway, so that's it. That's the saga. I'm just waiting for this guy to sue me for the money. Crazy. Caitlin: He has no grounds. If your bank account gets hacked, it's not, you're not liable for that. I'm not Shawn: a hundred percent sure that I'm [00:31:00] not going to be liable for it. So I'm kind of waiting to see how the dust settles. And like, honestly, if I am liable for it, I might just go to the news and blow it up because it's like, I can't believe Interac isn't secure. Yeah. Anyway, I got Elysse: an e transfer from A random person once, but the weird thing was that it was sent to me and it was for Seb and I was like, do you know this person? He was like, I don't. And I went, okay. Um, and so we called the bank and I was like, we have no idea who this person is. Like name is not familiar. Email's not familiar. Like, can you try and send it back? Cause there's like known scams going around right now where people send you e transfers if you have auto deposit. And when you try and send it back, it's like this whole thing of like, I can't actually remember how the scam goes, but at the time I was like, super familiar with what it was. And so I, I talked to the bank about it and they were like, well, we can try and send it back, but it needs to be accepted by the sender to go [00:32:00] back. So there's like really weird, like parameters around e transfers that make it like a really, like archaic way to move money around. I have no idea what ended up happening with it. They froze the money in my account for like six months. I think it's still in there. I just like, don't. Know what to do with it. It's only like 160 bucks though. But I'm like, I don't want it. Take it . Gavin: Yeah, just remove it. Take it out from my account. Do whatever you want Elysse: anyways. Pizza, Caitlin: pizza. Fe, how Gavin: do you say that? Fea Caitlin: fea. Fanna Fe Fanna mixture. This, and I literally went to go buy pizza immediately after seeing this site. Shawn: Oh, it's a restaurant. I like it. Oh, I, it's really good branding. Mm-Hmm. I can't. Elysse: I was gonna say I can't read any of that. I think it's all in, uh, Italian? Spanish? I don't know. Italian. Gavin: Looks Italian. Caitlin: Como. If you scroll down to the next graphic, this [00:33:00] really caught my attention. Oh man. I haven't seen stuff like this in a while and I'm really excited for us to start moving more towards like, collage y, stop motion, less like, pixel perfect visuals. I love this. Shawn: I like the stop motion stuff. It's cool. Yeah, I really like that terrazzo countertop too. Elysse: Yeah Terrazzo's in right now. Shawn: I hate it Caitlin: Really? Kevin, every podcast, I hate it. Gavin: Just being honest. I Elysse: have this funny story of us. This is a bit of a tangent. When we were in Italy, we had like a two day layover in Milan and accidentally because of our return flight. And Sev is a very big fan of mortadella, which is like the Italian bologna. I don't know why he loves it. It's like his favorite thing in the world. And so we go to this like deli. And the whole trip already, he's been eating more cured meats than I think, like, a human should consume in, like, a two week period. So we go to this deli, and he's like, I'm gonna get some [00:34:00] mortadella and, like, a couple other things. And, uh, he was like, you get cheese. And I was like, great, I can probably manage that. And being, like, a stupid tourist idiot, I go up to the counter and I'm like, what cheese pairs well with mortadella? And the guy just looks at me and he laughs. He's like, that's bologna. Like, what are you asking? He's like, you're asking like what nice cheese I have here that will pair with like a stupid bologna. I was so embarrassed. I was like, Caitlin: I don't know. There's nothing more humbling than going to a foreign country and asking questions like that. Elysse: I know. It's like, I don't know. Like, I don't know cheeses. I don't know meats. Anyways. I had a short Shawn: layover in Montreal, spent the whole flight there. It was just from Toronto, so it was a very short flight. Um, but, um, I was like on Duolingo and I was like, had specific phrases I was trying to learn. And, um, one of them was like how to order off a menu and get a drink. And anyway, so I like [00:35:00] go into this pizzeria and I order my pizza and my beer perfectly. And the waitress just like looks at me and answers in English with kind of like an eye roll. Elysse: Oh! In Montreal? Shawn: Yeah. Elysse: Oh yeah, they do that there all the time. Brutal. Good for you for learning though. Gavin: It's like, sorry, sir. We don't have any horses to serve, but, uh, would you like some pizza? Caitlin: I love this branding. Love it. Love it. Love it. It's beautiful. It's really Elysse: nice. It matches. Yeah. Cool. Cool. Cool. I'm loving these Caitlin: like neon colors coming back to like a royal blue. Yeah. It's awesome. I'm so over earth tones. I am so over it. Like it's in five years ago, if you told me that I want, we want to use like a bright color palette. I'd be like, no way, no way. And now I'm like, you earth tones are so icky. Shawn: She says in her earth [00:36:00] tone denim. Caitlin: This is real life different. Gavin: I shouldn't wear my. Oh, go ahead. Elysse: Oh, sir. I was going to say, there's just beautiful stuff on this website. Where are you going to wear Gavin? Gavin: I said, I should have wore my new Barbie sweater that my kids got me. It's like bright pink says Barbie on it. And it's got like nineties graphics, Barbie's graphics on the back. And they're like, you have to wear this. I was like, hell yeah. Caitlin: Hell yeah. Gavin: It was, it was my older daughter actually that picked it out too, which is amazing. That's cool. Yeah. June. I want to try this. Looks nice. I want to try it. Shawn: Just looks great. Elysse: Product analytics that work for you. June dot S O. Yeah, it looks nice. Gavin: It's still like, you know, kind of that typical site you would see, but there's something more bubbly and friendly about it. It's less, um, is Elysse: it the, is it the typography? , maybe. Gavin: But even the buttons feel rounder and Yeah. There's a lot of rounding going on. It's like Shawn: notion if you dialed up the playfulness a little bit. Yeah. A Gavin: little more playful. The buttons are, [00:37:00] yeah, the icons Shawn: and stuff. Caitlin: Do you find the other like API, this is API, right. Gavin: I assume it's an API. Yeah. I was going to say, Caitlin: are those just more like technical looking kind of boring? Gavin: I actually don't mind the technical ones. Cause I know they're trying to be technical. Yeah. It's the ones that are like technical trying to look like a marketing site with like big hero banners and stuff. And you're just like, Oh my God, like please stop using this template. Shawn: Yeah. I'm excited to try this. I, I have a thing for analytics APIs, like. We've tried Mixpanel, Kismetrix, Amplitude, Segment, um, I don't know. Intercom. Intercom, like every, Braze, um, we've tried everything and just nothing fits right. It's like a Goldilocks and the porridge scenario. Um, so I'm excited to try June, maybe. Gavin: I feel like, I feel like it doesn't exist, like for each individual person. It's like, it's like product management tools. It's [00:38:00] like, There isn't a good one. People are like, Oh, you should try insert name here. And I'm like, Nope. Tried it or Nope. It looks terrible or doesn't have the feature I need. Elysse: Is this a Vancouver company or do Shawn: they know that I'm Elysse: in Vancouver? Shawn: Wow. Get on board to product market fit. Look at that. Does it say team or anything somewhere? I'm curious. We got to dig into this. Maybe they are. Maybe we know them. Elysse: Customers. We're seeing maybe. I don't know. Gavin: At the bottom. Does it say like team or job or careers? There you go. Let's see careers. Yeah. Careers might be like, you have to work at our Vancouver office. Elysse: This is notion, right? Is this not, this looks like a notion Shawn: page. Yeah. Um, do, do, do, do. Yeah. I don't know. I don't, I don't think we're going deep. Elysse: I got to look this role. Is it a hybrid? Where's the office Gavin: type Vancouver? Elysse: We can literally just Google there. Did you hear that? Gavin: I did. I literally Elysse: almost dumped a [00:39:00] second cup of coffee on my desk. Shawn: She did it yesterday. I had to clean her desk. Maybe you should start drinking decaf. Elysse: I, I, this, I, it's not even about the coffee. Or a sippy cup. Shawn: We both went to sippy cups. I love it. Uh, I actually prefer to drink out of a, um, sippy cup, aka thermos with a lid. Like, I mean, it just. Peace of mind. If I knock it over, just a drop is going to come out. Caitlin: It's more practical. Have you guys heard about the second San Francisco city being built? Gavin: No, I thought that was Austin, Texas. Caitlin: No, so I was listening to the Daily the other day. The other day was yesterday, by the way. Um, but it was talking about how these, like, This, uh, plot of land was getting bought up right outside of San Fran. I did hear this. You hear about this, right? And it's all these lands all, like, adjacent to each other. And, like, they have no idea who the [00:40:00] hell is buying it. So, finally, this reporter looked into it. And it was, like, some of the wealthiest people in the world. I don't know who's buying it. Like LinkedIn co founder or it was Shawn: the Salesforce guy. Mark Benioff had something to do with it. Caitlin: Yes. So he wants to create a new city completely out of thin air and just build it on this farmland right outside of San Fran to solve the housing market in California or whatever. Like it's so there's going to be bike lanes. You're going to walk to your, uh, local businesses. We're going to build like, like dense neighborhoods where we could fit more people. And the farmers are so mad at them because they're like, we had no idea who we were selling this to. We don't want a city here. Like we've been here for generations. But then I thought if you're selling your land, you obviously don't give a shit about it. And you're just trying to make a profit off of it. Like you guys are both greedy. Like who, at least they're altruistic in a way out of profit, but I don't know. Yeah. I'm Shawn: all for a billionaire funded tech utopia cities. [00:41:00] Caitlin: Tell us why. Tell us more. Shawn: Yeah. I just, I just like to see a good vision executed, you know? I think if somebody has a vision, it's got to be better than the dog's breakfast that like, municipal elections gets in every municipality. Um, so, yeah. I'd like, I would love to see a vision executed. Hold on. We're Gavin: talking about a municipality that's about to be run by fucking Salesforce here, okay? Like, you want to talk about a dog's breakfast. Ha ha ha ha ha! Shawn: Yeah, I mean, hopefully there is some, um, separation between state and church there. You know? Like, uh, Salesforce. Yeah. But then, like, Caitlin: this is gonna be for sale. Like, what's the benefit for the people that own it, all those investors? They're gonna try and make a, you know, They can't just be doing this for their own good deed. I don't trust anyone in this scenario. Honestly. Like, what if it's like a Netflix thing or like Elysse: a streaming service thing? I'm going to make a show about it. Cause all I can think about is Truman show. That's it. Shawn: I think it's got to be legacy. I think after you achieve like billions and tech [00:42:00] stardom, you start to think like, what am I leaving behind? Caitlin: I don't trust this. Uber, Netflix, uh, Airbnb, they all have these like low price products and they hit the market and it's like different. Everyone moves to it. And then as soon as all the rest goes away, yeah, they just jack up the price and then everything else has gone. No copter. I got an Shawn: ad yesterday on my paid Netflix account and I almost canceled. I almost like, I was like, wait, wait, wait. I signed up to Netflix for my 9 a month or whatever for no ads. Yeah. Yeah, so now there's a higher tier. You've got to go to the 15 a month. They've introduced an additional premium tier, and the lower tier gets ads. They're far and few between. But it's like, like, to me, they've just broken the entire premise of signing up for a Netflix account. Like, I might still Gavin: cancel. It's back to Pirate Bay. Caitlin: I'm over it. I feel like they're going to do the same thing with AI. They're going to make it super cheap, everyone's going to use it, and then as soon as [00:43:00] everyone's on board, they just jack up the price for every month to use work that you can't, is not public anymore, or you know, just to use certain credits. Capitalism. I'm over it. I'm over it. Shawn: Move to the tech utopia city outside San Francisco. Yeah. It's Caitlin: a place of rainbows and happiness. Every night we pray to our Mark Zuckerberg shrine, the church of Zuckerberg. Elysse: Have you seen that video of him at that boxing match where he, people are like moving like clothes and stuff around him and he doesn't grab anything, but he's trying to like contribute as like a human would. Have you seen this? Gavin: I gotta find it. It's hilarious. We need to stream this. You Elysse: guys talk Structify while I find this little GIF. What Shawn: is Structify? I have no idea what this is. Yeah, Gavin: I love like what we were doing with um, uh, Oh shoot, I forgot the lady's name on our previous episode. Quickly save me. Caitlin: Coffee and Contracts [00:44:00] or Studio Jane? Gavin: Studio Jane. Nobody's going to help me? What was the question? It was Robin, Robin Newman. Studio Shawn: Jane. Sorry, I was gapping out there for a second. Yeah, Gavin: you guys just left me hanging. That was brutal. Sorry. I'm sweating. Shout out to Robin. Thanks for being on the pod. Yeah, thanks. I mean, I wasn't super involved. In your defense, have you ever Shawn: interacted with Robin outside that podcast? No, Gavin: exactly. So anyways, um, I loved when she was on the podcast, we had this thing where we're like, we had to guess what the site was. Or product was when we came to a site. And this is one of those moments, like data on demand, human quality, superhuman speeds. What, what is this exactly? Great. Hook me up with the data. Can I, I want, I want data on demand for Shawn: all my things. Elysse: I'm pretty sure one of you two shared this. No, I think it Shawn: might've been me, but it doesn't mean I know what it is. Easy Shawn: API. Gavin: And that's sweet Elysse: for all your research needs. It's vague. Gavin: Is it super AI? Like, is it taking in my data and giving me. Is it a scraping [00:45:00] service? Is there a, what is this product section? About about Caitlin: data independence for all. Gavin: I love that. We're all trying to read that. This, this is awful. Elysse: The amount of accessible information is faster than, yeah, this, I don't know what this is. Shawn: I just, let's look at solutions. What are the use cases? Caitlin: And grunt work. Shawn: Hmm. Caitlin: I don't, whatever that means. Gavin: We're gone. Shawn: I bet they're located, they're located in the tech utopia. Yeah, they're not existing yet. Yeah. Elysse: Okay, well, let's can this one because we only have six minutes left. And I want to show this, this Zuckerberg GIF. So, oh, it's so small. They're like handing things to other people. Yeah, what is happening here? But he doesn't know if he's supposed to like, like help. And so he's just like trying to human as best as he can. He's like, nope. He's like, yeah, I got it. He's like, nope. Oh, okay. Yep. [00:46:00] They Caitlin: replaced him with a robot like five years ago. I'm convinced. He's not a real human. Oh, that's my favorite. Shawn: Oh, the new Rivian. I'm seriously like, I don't care about the treehouse, but this Rx3, or R3x Rivian is like, It looks super cool. It's my new dream car. I really like it. Yeah, Elysse: let's maybe pull that up. I did share the treehouse, so I take a little bit of personal, um, personal, you know, anger from that one, Sean. Caitlin: I know I'm wearing the color of the car, but that color is so icky. That teal. Shawn: I like it. I would rock it. Caitlin: I don't know. Shawn: But I know how you feel about earth tones. Caitlin: Yeah, as I'm wearing like the most earth tone today. Look at this. Shawn: Isn't it lovely? It looks like an old golf, like on steroids. You know what it reminds Gavin: me of is, um, a squashed version of the new Bronco. Like if you were to squish the top of the Bronco. Yeah, I like that Bronco if it wasn't Ford. Caitlin: I was going to say Range Rover. Gavin: Yeah, it's almost like a Bronco and a Range Rover had a baby. Yeah. Elysse: Why [00:47:00] does this feel like not the way you should advertise trunk space? Shawn: Yeah. I mean, I feel like they should have put a roof rack on it and put the surfboard on the roof rack, but there's something, yeah. It's like your surfboard won't fit. Caitlin: Exactly. Elysse: I saw a Rivian. Oh, I was just going to say really quickly, this is interesting. Cause the charging port doesn't have a fast charger on it. Is the Rivian charger like unique to Rivian? I don't, I didn't think they could do that anymore. No, I think Shawn: it has to be one of the two NACS or the other one. I can't remember. Um, Elysse: interesting. Interesting. Okay. Shawn: Does that look different? That looks like the one at my house. Elysse: This is a level two charger. So level three is a, is a, like a fast charger and then there's a super fast. Um, but the level two is like your washer dryer. It charges within 12 hours. So It doesn't look like they have the, unless you have an adapter for it. Yeah. Shawn: You can get an, like all the Tesla's come with an adapter to go like to level [00:48:00] two. I have a level two charger at my Airbnb. And I read that it's the most widely used format. Tesla's use a different format, but they come with an adapter. Um, you're lucid, I guess. No, sorry, not lucid. Your pole star must be a level three. Do you have a level three charger at your apartment? Elysse: No, we don't have that charger in our apartment, but we have, um, like it has the level two and then the prong at the bottom for the level three. So we can do like a level two or supercharge on it without the adapter. So maybe that's what that is. No, maybe. Yeah. Shawn: It's bigger than it looks. If you compare the human to the, to the car, it's bigger than it looks. It looks like it should be the size of a golf, but I think it's much bigger. Elysse: Yeah. You know what I think this is competing with is the bubbles have the like C 60s. Like those new, those are nice. Yeah. Shawn: Yeah. I'm into this. Yeah. I tried to pitch my wife on it [00:49:00] yesterday. She said, are you kidding? You're going to smash that one too. Too Caitlin: soon, Gavin. Too soon. Oh my God. Shawn: Remember when you smashed my truck, Gavin? Into that sweet old lady's car? Gavin: The sweet old lady? I do remember that. She got out of her car. Shawn: So Gavin decided to drive my truck like an idiot and did like a big drift around a corner and smashed into some sweet old lady in like a four door sedan. And, uh, The poor woman got out of the vehicle in tears and said, I've never been in an accident. She's like 80 plus. Yeah. We're like, wow, Gavin: good run. Gavin's Caitlin: like, this is how I roll. Get with it, lady. Like, Gavin: like why are you in my way, bitch? Move. Caitlin: Ruthless. Jeez. Shawn: That's how they do it in Alberta. [00:50:00] Elysse: We've got two minutes left to look at this Porsche. Gavin: Corey's into Porsches. Shawn: You know, that's it. But yeah, that's it. I've never been a Porsche man. I just like, I don't know. I mean, I like the Porsche on bad boys that Will Smith drove. Um, what is that? An original nine 11 or something. Um, but, uh, yeah. Like, I don't know. I haven't really seen a Porsche that's done it for me. This is a pretty nice Porsche, although this video is just this guy talking. But, um, Have you guys Caitlin: ever heard of Pagani? Shawn: No. Pagani? No. Caitlin: Google the car. They're worth like three million dollars. Could you Elysse: spell it for me? Oh, that's this week's Gavin: expensive object. Caitlin: Yeah. P A G A N I. I think they're based in California, maybe? I have no idea, actually. Maybe Italian. Shawn: Oh, yeah, that's Italian. Those cookie banners. Those cars Caitlin: look like, uh, fake cars. They look like toys. They're crazy. [00:51:00] Sport car esque. Uh, which one? Present? Present. Shawn: I would've gone for future. Whoa! That looks like a Okay, okay. Yeah, looks like an Italian supercar. Caitlin: Yeah. And it has like these little bug antennas and like all these like ex like other features on them. Yeah. I can't like do it. Can't be Shawn: electric. That looks like a combustion. Oh, it's Caitlin: car, car. You should Google the images. Just go to images right away and we'll show. Okay. Sorry. Come on, Elise. There you go. It looks like a bug. Gavin: It's like an F1 car. Yeah. I think I saw one of these in Vancouver. Caitlin: Very possible. Looks like a Bugatti Bugatti with a little thing. Crazy. Elysse: Three million dollars. Wow, this really opens up like a Transformer. Wow, Shawn: that's so dope. I saw a 300, 000 G Wagon in the Mercedes dealership the other day. Um, it was just like this black on black Jeep [00:52:00] looking thing. I was like in the dealership for a service on my van. I just wandered over as you do to the cars in the showroom and I'm like, Oh, this Jeep is cool. I could cruise for 300, 000. Yeah, it's crazy. Jeez. Elysse: Um, well that's it. That's all we got today. Uh, that's been, it's been good. Right on. Caitlin. Caitlin: My last podcast as input. Shawn: I was going to say, you better be back. You better be back. You may be a, uh, really like high profile guest from open phone. Uh, yeah, yeah. From your new Elysse: Silicon Valley, weird neighborhood. Yeah, I'm going to Caitlin: be living in the Mark Zuckerberg land with my shrines. People will Elysse: hand you things and you won't know how to hold them. Caitlin: I'll be a robot by the time I come back. Maybe Shawn: we should review the open phone, um, new employee welcome kit on the next podcast episode. Oh yeah, we should do an unboxing. That would be great. I would [00:53:00] love Elysse: that. Cool. Thanks guys. It's been a slice. Talk to you next week. Ciao. Bye. [00:54:00] Bye.